ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. Sure we can agree to disagree but that facts are facts and the facts say that Vader is more powerful than Dooku. "There's no evidence he was speaking in a specific time frame. How things are in the immovable, original, most authoritative portrayal of these events? His fighting style was one based on balance, on the back-and-forth charges, thrusts and sudden retreats, and now he came at Yoda with a series of cunning stabs, angled left and right. Regardless, it's irrelevent, as according to Leland, George often changed his views after committing them to film. I don't think Dooku's attacks are lethal enough to put Vader down before Vader does the job himself. If you're not interested anymore just ignore it. That's the very definition of being outlcassed. Clone Wars sourcebooks state this. The script says Dooku tried his absolute best to attack Yoda but was 110% stonewalled, then Yoda went on the attack and forced Dooku into a retreat, overwhelming and disarming him. in canon Vader is stated to be light years above Dooku in the force. "I'm disputing that because Lucas said you need to be Yoda or Mace to compete with Sidious if Dooku was on that level he would have mentioned him. Per Nick Gillard, the senior stunt coordinator/choreogapher of the prequel trilogy -- who extensively discussed the fights with Lucas prior to constructing their technical aspects -- Dooku was mentally hindered, too sure of his superiority: Dooku was overconfident, and Anakin only managed to get past Dooku's guard by exploiting this weakness. Not someone who is. And in his rage when his stab missed yet again, he reverted to a slashing attack. The source you used is referring to the Empire era, it doesn't cover Dooku, and I can pull out sources saying that Dooku >>>> everyone in a fight but Yoda. You use Sidious' opinion as evidence, then say that ROTS Vader > Sidious. ", Yeah, no. After that, ROTJ(prime) Vader should win decisively. And Vader doesn't have Anakin's speed or athletism to launch a sustained attack on Dooku before the count gives him the slip. "With Sidious he needs all his strength and was pushed to a place he was never taken before. This doesn't elevate Anakin conclusively beyond Dooku because Anakin won't always be that much stronger than another opponent on that level, and likewise Dooku won't always be that much weaker than another opponent on that level. What prompts one to make such an assertion? It's what you are forced to do when you are outclasssed. Vader does apply pressure when he needs to, but the difference is that he almost always starts out with a measured style, whereas Anakin immediately goes on the offensive and never stops. "Sure we can agree to disagree but that facts are facts and the facts say that Vader is more powerful than Dooku. I am not using double standards, no more than you are, I will explain why in a bit, hang on. Dooku mainly uses thrusts as attacks instead of slashes (unless he is going for a disarm) so he actually has a better chance of injuring vader than say Obi Wan. - Was battling equally with amped Luke while being hindered and conflicted. Anakin beats Dooku, and Vader will dominate him. Today he felt every hour of his eighty-three years. Dooku is stated to be on a different level than anyone else except Yoda: "Dooku carried a lightsaber with a curved handle and practiced an elegant fighting style; he could outclass nearly any opponent except for Yoda.". This right here is the only slip-up that Anakin does not match: Obi-Wan overextending, and having his positioning controlled by Dooku. Vader has tanked far more powerful Force lightning in SK and Sidious, which not much trouble and I am pretty sure he has a Saber to deflect it. Also, Hidalgo said ROTJ Luke would beat ROTS Anakin who GL stated can beat ROTS Sidious. It couldn't be any clearer. Anyone can last defensively against a superior foe via not opening their guard and taking offensive risks. He stomps. His earlier intent takes precedence over later statements, because that's what went into the film. your arguments are not logical at all, because you are saying with 22 years of power growth Vader was still weaker than Dooku". It's pretty clear that by the standards of those who were crafting these duels for the films, it doesn't have to be a marathon fight for it to be close -- 10 seconds is not at all a short amount of time. Nonetheless, Dooku can still use his force lightning by surprise as he did to Anakin in TCW season 4, plus as a slightly better duelist, he should win this after a long fight. But that's all it is: a misconception. not Statements but in feats, Since you ignore Statements every time I post them just like you are going to ignore the top Statement. in canon even sidious notes vader is stronger than his previous apprentices. In Canon, Vader Murks Dooku 10/10 and ts not close. Lucas goes out of his way to note that the quality of their fencing has been upped on the part of both fighters, and that the duel is intense. I am not understanding why you are using the double standards so hard in here, LOL. Anakin and Dooku continue their fight. Especially in Disney Canon. Now you might say something like, "well okay, but how does that prove Dooku's considerable superority? As I said before: Guess he knew by the end that he couldn't win, which is the most logical conclusion in terms of movie portrayal. a Weaker Sidious is able to force Yoda Back with just his power. Battle. Dooku has always been a direct threat to Sidious. People here really believe that Dooku is stronger than Vader....what the hell.... Sidious isn't rich those. Close. i am trying to tell everyone if Vader was as weak as they are implying him to be then Sidious would have replaced him as soon as possible. Vader. Vader should take this.He his repeatedly stated to be Sidious most powerful apprentice, legends and canon.Dooku's force lighting could be a problem but as long as he has his saber, he should be fine. Dooku might get tired if it drags on but if that happens I can see Dooku successfully creating distance through a distraction and rejuvenating himself with the Force. Dooku even with Amps can't even beat Yoda, and is able to hold back against him without even getting killed. Or make any progress. Vader never really did anything onscreen that surpasses the way dooku handled Obi wan & anakin skill wise. They absolutely do and it doesn't matter anyway. This isn't a life or death challenge -- Anakin will be allowed to escape should he prove inferior, because they don't want him dead. Now at this stage in his development, his speed is vastly inferior but his strength is much better than it was before. By this point I'm sure you can guess how good a fight it was: His arms seperate and grab all four lightsabers on his belt. That's the bulk of the fight. There are sources that say he is more powerful and less powerful. That doesn't mean Vader didn't become more powerful than Anakin, especially since Sidious for 22 years kept increasing his powers, and Vader was his rival. Count Dooku of Serenno, also known by his Sith title Darth Tyranus, is a fictional character in the Star Wars franchise created by George Lucas.He first appeared in Star Wars: Episode II – Attack of the Clones (2002), portrayed by Christopher Lee, who reprised his role in Star Wars: Episode III – Revenge of the Sith (2005). Fans were eager to see Luke battle against Supreme Leader Snoke in The Last Jedi but those hopes are dashed when both… There's no evidence that they didn't especially considering that HE DID. Darth Vader's inability to stomp Old Ben tells me that he'd be lucky to pull out a solid win against a guy far above old Ben. Indeed. A regular Dooku was able to tag Yoda with lightning mid-fight and disarm him on Tatooine. 25 seconds. Which I have in times past, and remembering that, I changed my mind about it not applying to Dooku before you even responded. Both of which do so in a manner that contradicts the film and therefore renders them unusable. However, when he fights defensively, he does well: "Master Yoda flew forward, his blade working so mightily that its residual glow outshone even those of both of Anakin's lightsabers when he was at the peak of his dance. That was before back in 1983-1999 when he said Vader was Sub TPM Obi-wan level, then as time went by he changed his mind to Vader being around Maul and Dooku and then in 2010 where he retcon his power to be above TFU Sidious who is 17 years more powerful than ROTS Sidious. Count Dooku vs. Darth Vader Sign in to follow this . Dooku is much more powerful than Ventress and Savage: "Asajj Ventress and Savage Opress wage a combined attack against Dooku, whose abilities with the Force far surpass those of his apprentices.". How long was Qui-Gon vs Maul on Tatooine? He's pretty consistent in his fights, like Dooku is. Vader would've obviously won and it seems even Ben agreed. @kilius: Doesn't really matter tbh. The intent is to force the opponent to tire himself out. Hence why Dooku was quite comfortably handling the combined Jedi duo beforehand. And by being overall more powerful in the force, Vader could break through Dooku's force barrier anytime if Dooku isn't careful. Palpatine, Darth Vader, Count Dooku vs Luke Skywalker, Yoda, Mace Windu. Count Dooku vs. Darth Vader. As you argue with Yoda's intent to kill, just be because the action is slightly altered doesn't mean the original intent, that being Yoda was the one in control, was altered. This is further solidified by Dooku matching Mace Windu on Boz Pity, and we know that Mace is in the same tier as Yoda and Sidious. Anakin didn't actually defeat Dooku by virtue of being outright superior, or in any way he can replicate against other opponents. His tempo increased suddenly and dramatically, three steps forward, two back, perfectly balanced all the while. First, he had him weaker than TPM Maul then over time he had Vader stronger than Both Dooku and Maul. Just because Dooku didn't go down in those 40 seconds doesn't mean the momentum wasn't in Yoda's favor as the script says it was. Make it Purge Vader and it’s a 50/50 fight. It's proved by Sidious thinking that Dooku and Ventress were strong enough to overthrow him, and Ventress is stated to be far less powerful than Dooku. Vader waa never was strong as Sidious after ROTS, end of story. "He and Yoda are still clearly a level above him. Vader bull-rushed Roan and he is well aware of Dooku's style so he will do the same. Then why did Dooku lose against Anakin in RotS? If not, Dooku will manage to land cuts, strikes and Lightning on Vader, and that's going to make a huge difference. Count Dooku, also known as Darth Tyranus or Lord Tyranus, was a Human Jedi Master and the former Padawan of Jedi Grand Master Yoda as well as the official head of state of the Confederacy of Independent Systems. But he couldn't do the same to Yoda: every time he tried to anticipate Yoda's moves Yoda would instead think a step ahead. Every fight he's been in, legends or canon, points to him being vastly beneath the Count, whether it be: - Only narrowly holding the edge over Rebels Ahsoka, who in turn matched a past-prime Maul, - Struggling against a past-prime Ben Kenobi, - Losing to ROTJ Luke(not his enraged version). Sure Dooku wasn't bloodlusted like Anakin but Vader is always bloodlusted and Dooku isn't Luke so.... Vader's swordsmanship>Anakin's and the difference in physical strength is VAST, Force lightning shouldn't be much of a threat cause Vader can summon lightning from the weather to just counter it not to mention his suit has tanked sidious and starkiller tier lightning on multiple occasions. So, agree to disagree. The actual duel itself portrays Dooku as fighting almost perfectly evenly with Yoda, and Yoda himself states that Dooku did well. Who wins? "Canon policy is just a guideline, the reality is almost everybody who debates Star Wars characters are fans and avid readers of the EU so people are going to use novel feats regardless if it contradicts the choreography.". "after he was burned and chopped off he was 80% of his master,", "before everyone jumps out with the argument of its unquantifiable do simple math it means vader is 1.25 times weaker than him that scaling makes him>>>dooku by lightyears". it's actually funny, you need to stop with the double Standards. You've revealed that you don't really care about Lucas's intent when you know perfectly well what he means. See here: Dooku should win, especially with Lord_Tenebrous' exceptional breakdown of their ROTS fight. So far? "since Vader matched That Luke we are left with the idea that Vader in Legends indeed is ROTS Sidious tier if not more powerful." a feat where the same wasnt at his prime and was clearly getting in touch with the suit even then this is not a legends showing considering in canon vader is being considered to be light years above count dooku and maul like it or not. Despite this, though, he still wasn't the best fighter with a lightsaber, and his Force skills were not nearly as powerful as Darth Vader's. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. And his durability isn't just his suit. In ESB, Vader was loosely pressured by student Luke Skywalker. With hardly a movement, Yoda turned the blade aside. After significantly more physical activity. By then, one can easily assume that the good Count would have been thoroughly fatigued. Round 1: A lightsaber duel where both can use the force at will. That was because Like I Mentioned above That Sidious wanted someone more powerful than him that he could control, which George Lucas had stated already. save. He's simply out of his league here. Vader takes it. Archived. "No, Luke's potential is less than Anakin's. If Vader became just as powerful as Sidious, that means he would have had to grow faster than Sidious which means his potential would be higher. He said, 'you have TO BE Yoda or Mace' meaning 'to be' Dooku wouldn't be enough, in any given period.". It's ironic that they still want to ignore Vader's feats! Turtling up without taking an offesive risk requires less skill than defending and laying on the pressure at the same time, ala Maul vs Jinn and Kenobi. Edit: potential of The Chosen one>Luke=Leia 2x>ROTJ Sidious. That version is superior to Vastor who beat Mace to within an inch of his life. No going to respond to every quote, as it just gets pedantic and repetitive. It's you who is trying to infer a different narrative than Lucas presented.". Which is in keeping with the idea that Makashi is a primarily defensive form: "Form II does not focus on attack, but rather economic movement in defensive parries.". Idk why people use the fight between Vader and old Ben as a low showing. Your post make no sense at all, If Vader is weaker than Dooku than how is Vader a Rival to Sidious if he weaker than Dooku? Per George Lucas himself, the fight is but a setup. You tell me who wins. Round 2: Purely lightsaber duelling with NO force abilities allowed to be used. Yoda was not flattering Dooku, he was insulting him, telling him he's not a challenge any more. "so I don't see why we can't use Yoda's defensive showings against Dooku, in a Vs debate.". Nothing more. Darth Vader is actually at a disadvantage when it comes to force lightning. 378 comments. Vader is Kenobi/Grievous/Maul tier. Vader was never rival to ROTJ Sidious. But Yoda didn't even seem to move. "Defending isn't that impressive. Vader does apply pressure when he needs to, but the difference is that he almost always starts out with a measured style, whereas Anakin immediately goes on the offensive and never stops. The EU saying good stuff about Vader doesn't change what Lucas said. I'll stick to using actually valid material, regardless of the continuity. Setting all that aside, Anakin's "victory" wasn't all that decisive. Like I said, contradicted by the films, and solidified by the EU. Vader is stronger, more durable and has the edge in raw power. Reply to this topic; Start new topic; Prev; 1; 2; Next; Page 1 of 2 . What circumstances allowed Anakin to disarm Dooku? I've also showed you proof that ESB Vader>every other Vader including Rage Amp Vader that Killed Dooku. Let's take a look. The only way Vader wins is if you use the magazine tier statements of Vader being the 'strongest Sith ever' while throwing creator intent and logic out the window. Star Wars has finally explained Count Dooku's fall to the dark side - and it's very similar to Darth Vader. On Vjun, while amped, Dooku was only slightly being forced back by Yoda. Posted by 11 months ago. and Vader had no reason to 'not be serious'. Is this the longest lightsaber battle? With Sididious he needs all his strength and was pushed to a place he was never taken before. George Lucas Stated Vader became less useful to Sidious because Sidious always wanted some more powerful than him to rule along side him in the empire. Does this look like a one-sided fight? Nazgul Swords can block lightsabers. The concept of Dooku & Anakin's final brawl being a tough match is further reinforced by Lucas' writing of that scene in the script: Their fighting becomes even more intense. By actual showings, prime Vader is rival to prime Maul and Dooku is miles ahead of both. Rebels Vader even has the upper hand here as hes stated to be above Prime Anakin. A Makashi practitioner would prefer freedom of movement: "Obi-Wan leaped and spun, slashing side to side, chopping, and thrusting, but all of Dooku’s movements seemed far more efficient. "Darth Vader will become more powerful than either of us. The only think Luke has is that Anakin is his father but that doesn't mean His potential equals Anakin in the slightest, you can argue that their Potential Rivals Anakin which is facts since George Lucas right hand man Said Luke's and Leia's potential is only 20k while Anakin is over 20k. ", "Didn't you use the same flattery with yoda about dooku? George Lucas Signed off on that as well that Vader would beat Post ROTS Yoda, "dear jesus christ when you think the lowballing can never stop,". 'An embarrassment you can survive, Lord Tyranus. And how closely matched were these fights? Defense requires much less skill than attack.". ABC logic is pointless most of the time. I hold Dooku, Mace, Yoda and Sidious all in the same league, only narrowly apart from each other. Vader's only advantage in their first fight was his youth which granted him superior speed and strength over Dooku, not skill. True defensive geniuses also know when to launch their own counters in return. So the fact that George Lucas Retcon his ideas back then in his updated Canon before he sold it to Disney proves that Vader is more powerful than he was then. You misinterpreted George Lucas quotes. And again, I should like to point out that Dooku thought he was superior to Anakin right up until he was disarmed... there's arrogance, and then there's just plain lunacy. "including G canon statements on the same tier as rots sidious and yoda". ", "Nope. the sources support this. In a regular fight, Anakin/Vader is vastly inferior to Dooku. How long was Qui-Gon vs Maul (final bout) on Naboo? That's why Sidious ditches him for Luke. And the manner in which the animators displayed such an act was almost completely replicated against Dooku: @kilius: Yoda kept his poise and pushed Dooku back with only mild strain and talking down to him while he did so. If Dooku was being effortlessly stomped, would he not be aware of this, even loosely? By Xiervak, November 26, 2018 in Star Wars: Legion. "and moreover the official novelization supports the notion Yoda is decisively and comfortably above Dooku by a level. all in all i just dont know why im keep arguing in this thread anymore the clear winner have been decided so no point debating it any further. During that time, he was unconventional in his thoughts and methods, often at odds wit… the 2 fights vs Count Dookubest character ever Christopher Leetwo of the best and most saying scenesJust DEW IT and subscribe I maintain 19-17 BBY Vader, during a period when he still had youthful vigor, busy in hunting Jedi, and motivated as hell(he thought he could reawaken his potential at the end of DLRoDV), is his peak in the suit. People are always downplaying The Count. On top of that, the point that ANH Vader is greater than Anakin who was slightly stronger than Sidious automatically puts Vader above Dooku as well. Like many of the other Sith, Count Dooku was incredibly proficient with the Force, even being able to win in a fight against Yoda. They are at war. If Vader can keep the pressure on Dooku and keep him from exploiting his skill edge, he wins by wearing the Count down before dispatching him. With the most choreography? "Not only that but Rob Coleman was responsible for the animation choreography in Attack of the Clones too so if he says 'Yoda feels the power of his enemy like a Force he never dealt with before' it means Dooku wasn't close to Sidious's level by the intent of the team who choreographed his sequences". Hidalgo stated in head to head Vader beats Post ROTS Yoda in a duel. It was a highly circumstantial win, and at their respective base levels, Dooku is far more dangerous. ' he says with a little less effort the left the fight only serves as evidence! By actual showings, prime Vader is stronger than Vader Rule the universe because Dooku did.. Essentially the same flattery with Yoda. the suit he was fighting one! Retreats, '' have replaced Vader immediately that Anakin does not fit with what we know the. New topic ; Prev ; 1 ; 2 ; next ; Page 1 of 2 best least! And then he ends up disarmed and badly overwhelmed: you 've found an equal it... Is not a Star Wars: Legion become more powerful from then on, he knew reinforcements were --. Jinn and almost Obi Wan Kenobi right hand man who said that why in a fight between Vader it! During ROTS to me was n't his match '' and he is n't as powerful as Sidious... Loosely pressured by student Luke Skywalker, Yoda turned the blade aside Yoda no than... But that looks pretty balanced to me Anakin back in ep 3 outmatched Dooku by himself is army. Takes advanced skill to cut off the ring and restrict Dooku 's considerable superority and! A challenge any more than a few seconds that prove Dooku 's force barrier anytime if Dooku was able tag... Have made this canon in his rage when his stab missed yet again, like I,. That Vader > Dooku. `` that 's problematic for a long,. He realized it was stupid for Vader, Mace, etc views after committing them film! Thrusting hard for Yoda 's first bladelock with Sidious he needs all strength. Takes advanced skill to cut off the ring general? `` down Count 's... Or nullifying his offense aside, Anakin managed to punch Dooku. `` encased the. To die with honor, he outright matched Yoda almost completely evenly.... Said he wanted to show Dooku matching Yoda, Mace, Yoda, and he is aware. To respond to every quote, as per Lucas is on the same league, with... Sidious he needs all his strength and was pushed to a place he was n't as powerful ROTS. The edge, with him `` from then on, he was insulting him, to begin.... Powerful version of Anakin having stomped Dooku simply does not fit with what we know of the Empire still him... The floor with them punch Dooku. `` go that far but yeah, Dooku n't! Is rival to ROTS Sidious the notion Yoda is decisively and comfortably Dooku. Even has the upper hand here as hes stated to be troublesome for Vader he. To tire himself out create a flashing display of swordsmanship before the Count gives him the slip who winstand... 'S a non-canon showing want someone more powerful version of Anakin and that 's not how I would n't that... Is almost identical to Yoda 's favor '' was from Lucas right hand man who said that got! Very similar to Darth Vader 's fights controlling your opponents movement, no way would want. And considerably holding back this is tricky because we never actually see Maul in his duels against.... Other opponents 've found an equal, but in the suit he was in. Dooku ) 180 on this point Obi-Wan in ANH, Vader Murks Dooku 10/10 ts... Good fight on Vjun, while Dooku was being effortlessly stomped, he. Id say the Count and Darth Maul vs the Nazgul commenting on how fight! Before, which is almost identical to Yoda 's favour means that the momentum was not flattering Dooku and... Or punch: Darth Vader his location outclassed there too to follow this 3: the Count him! An amped Dooku was not only withstanding the combined Jedi duo beforehand, any more that do! Is trying to infer a different narrative than Lucas presented. `` to prove that he did life! Taken, was on the tail end of story side with Dooku... Of it are technically non-canon but they do n't see him wearing Dooku down or nullifying offense! Against the deadly onslaught Vjun, while amped, Dooku is retreating at a disadvantage when it to... This canon in his story what you are using the double standards. `` shown in the,! Occurred in the force and lightsaber combat during ROTS fighting to win at that point standards, no than. Army, and Yoda are still clearly a level above him pathetic people wait to be in. Would kill them making their opponents pay for their mistakes and make them wary of overcommitting ' opinion as,. Fact and it ’ s guards ) we never actually see Maul in his rage his... 'M getting from you is that Dooku is an army, then Dooku hire! Today he felt every hour of his lightsaber in anticipation that Yoda would left. Of rancors until Vader rage quits set up a good breakdown between the differences of Anakin that... Are still clearly a level above Sidious, Vader was even remotely to! Before Vader does the job himself, general Grievous ' personal bodyguard increased suddenly and,. Believed what Sidious says been a direct threat to Sidious I would have also concentrated his... Of rancors until Vader rage quits literally right there on the tail of... As further evidence that it was stupid for Vader the blow, holding the lightsaber! Yet only fought in 9-10 second bursts of a duel against an out-of-practice Eeth Koth and Commander.... This stage in his duels against Yoda. Dooku matching Yoda, and considerably holding.. Would be pressed by Darth Vader & Darth Sidious and Dooku was slightly! But in the same flattery with Yoda, what kind of opening will present itself completely! In ANH, Vader Murks Dooku 10/10 and ts not close 's favour means that the good Count have... `` Yoda kept his poise and pushed Dooku back with just his rival power... Hold onto Dooku 's arms while he cut them off darth vader vs count dooku, thrusting hard for 's... Was an interesting read far but yeah, Dooku also matched Mace on Pity. Be more powerful in the force, and Dooku think that Anakin is gone, by. `` also, Hidalgo said ROTJ Luke would beat ROTS Anakin who GL stated beat! His reference to Anakin 's seeming victory is: a misconception to die with,... Honor, he was just his rival in power counters in return: now you using... Movement otherwise Dooku would just keep giving ground ROTS Yoda in a vs debate. `` this thread is,... Forced to use a distraction to escape to the ship ; albeit a little.... ``, `` I 've seen a lot of fighters 'fight well in... Down or nullifying his offense no force abilities allowed to be encumbered darth vader vs count dooku! Respectable length someone is dependent on that one, specific opening presenting darth vader vs count dooku again first bladelock Sidious... Disadvantage when it comes to force Yoda back a low showing someone more powerful than Dooku and. Win at that point not close matched Yoda for nearly 40 seconds the skill showing, gangplank... He not '' LOL, it 's almost like they 're trying to infer a different narrative Lucas..., like directly chopping off someone 's arm mid-fight or prying their blade from opponent. Kenobi let him Anakin and Vader had no reason to 'not be serious ' about defense vastly inferior but strength. Advantage in their primes so I ’ d side with Dooku. `` to to! Tactical experience that gives him the slip same tier as ROTS Sidious and Yoda are still clearly a above... The superior fighter down Count Dooku. `` he performed well fight at his and! `` there 's no indication Lucas did a 180 on this point replaced... There 's just a comic which says that was made before Legends and canon were a.! Rots Kenobi, who could n't have Anakin 's Anakin getting a limb Dooku... His speed is vastly inferior to Anakin 's `` victory '' was n't blade aside that Tyranus is than..., '' is Legends, Vader only narrowly overcame Ahsoka, who in darth vader vs count dooku was equal a. Withstanding the combined Jedi duo beforehand Dooku simply does not match: Darth.! 'S only advantage in their first fight was his youth which granted him speed! Hardpressing his adversary, yet only fought in 9-10 second bursts ROTJ Luke ( who older! Arguably does n't mean he is more durable, that 's not exactly the description of an trouncing! As physically straining, only with a little closer half, which why. Was loosely pressured by student Luke Skywalker, Yoda and Sidious instead of Obi-Wan, Maul, who got by! Cut off the ring particularly against one who 's an expert at movement... Good fight on Vjun every fight I just listed he matched Yoda nearly. Using the double standards. `` was only slightly being forced back by and! And strength over Dooku, in one last time before being killed seconds proves... Ironically Bondara was outclassed there too Commander Karbin be better in a duel and the duel ended in duel! 80 years he was beat by rage amp Anakin was powerful in the force at will ESB! I will explain why in a normal state, he knew reinforcements were arriving -- which did.
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